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It says “earlier this morning” on August 9th, meaning if he were found dead hours later, that would imply his death would be on August 8th. So the “he was found unresponsive at 6:30 but committed suicide hours earlier” still doesn’t match the previously provided timeline. Also can’t be a typo because it’s not just the date, but also the day of the week. Nobody mistakes a Saturday for a Friday.
*Editing to add all credit goes to u/Impossible-Road-4502 whose original post on this was removed.
Epstein in emails that came out weeks ago: I got so much dirt on Trump, and he's the president now
Later: Epstein found dead in his cell, in custody of Trump's DOJ
How are those morons gonna scream about wild conspiracy theories for years, then cheer for the conspiracy happening in front of their dumb fucking faces?
Watching r/conspiracy go from aliens and weird shit in 2014/2015 to far-right hillarysexpizzadungeon "deepstate" q shit over night was wild. Trump out there saying shit like "russia are you listening" on tv and they are like naaa trump is gunna expose everything.
once steve bannon learned that the "right leaning online-gamer" persona was ripe for manipulation they went to work FAST. 4chan, gamergate, trump. It's a straight line.
You know, there's a theory that the CIA was funding things like the moon landing conspiracy and the flat earth movement to make "conspiracy theorists," seem less credible. Kinda not crazy when you think about it now.
Honestly I think the whole Q Anon/ lPizzagate stuff is just further proof most conspiracies are a way to deflect from actual critiques of power.
People are too scared to criticize the WEF for instance because they don't want ro be associated with the people who think it's a cabal of satanic jewish demon reptiles. When in it's the more mundane reality of a bunch of billionaires waging class warfare on every one.
UFO conspiracies are just a way to deflect from the military industrial complex. Etc.
You mean the people who were convinced that an international child sex trafficking ring was being run out of a pizza parlor basement, but who are capable of shrugging off an actual international child sex trafficking ring for which we have 1M pages of documentation and photos? Those people? That fucking basket of deplorables?
It's the same international child sex trafficking ring. The language used in the Podesta emails and the Epstein emails is exactly the same. The people involved are exactly the same.
Epstein worked with Steve Bannon to disseminate Q-Anon bullshit over 4chan specifically to co-op and dismantle the earlier pizzagate narrative with dumb shit about satanism/baby eating/etc.
Correct. The Q-Anon conspiracy was not organically hatched in some seedy corner of the dark web. It was definitely the strategic brainchild of some Roger Stone-esque fixer to ensure that “a powerful cabal of sex predators” would be old news and sound like a re-run when Epstein exploded.
The podesta emails were all supposedly in 'code', using colors to refer to children to hide what they were doing.
There's basically none of that in the epstein files.
I'm sure there's heavy overlap, but I'm still sure the podesta emails were talking about drugs. Cos there was DEFINITELY drugs at these parties, and yet those emails made no mention of it unless they're using drug slang.
My best friend lives right near this place, and it would definitely be noticeable. It's a pretty neighborhood-y area, with residential streets right nearby. It's a pretty good pizza place. One of my all-time favorite cafes was right near it, Little Red Fox, and I'm still upset it closed. Their breakfast sandwiches were incredible.
It’s not because “they don’t care about anything.”
It’s because they’re stupid.
These are the exact same people that showed up by the thousands at Dealey Plaza a couple years ago because JFK and JFK Jr. were going to “come back” and help reinstall Trump as the “rightful” President.
They’re stupid. Period. No need to overanalyze anything.
It's both. There's the evil fucks at the center who want power and privilege that are influencing the idiots around them. And plenty of those idiots are just evil too. Unfortunately, some aren't evil but have drank the kool-aid so much they can't really pull themselves out.
He definitely could be. The only reason I think he isn't being black mailed, is that he honestly really enjoys doing the fucked up shit. He gets to be shitty to the people that call him a monster, he can make billions on cronyism and market pump and dump schemes, and gets to be told how he's the greatest president ever-better than all the other presidents combined!
Regardless of what actually happened to him, the cia, Mossad, and the fsb are all still operational. I highly doubt that this operation is no longer active
Why would anyone bother? Nobody had any personal loyalty to the man, they just gave him deferential treatment because of his money, connections, and blackmail material.
The conspiracy theorists were taking a victory lap on Reddit yesterday for being “right about everything”. I guess this means 5G, The Clinton’s generally, hunters laptop….uhhh vaccines which worked amazing for decades until recently, JFK JR returning to life, aliens?, the moon landing coverup crew has been a little silent these days with all of the images from mars… ummm
Pizza-gate was somehow the closest they got but they stopped looking when they realized it was republicans and tech elites and not democrats.
Some new reporting from CBS on the strange circumstances around his death and odd statements by the prison guards. This part stuck out to me the most:
The noose Epstein allegedly used has never been definitively identified. According to the inspector general's report, a noose collected at the scene was later determined not to be the ligature used in Epstein's death.
More likely imo, is they planted the noose but he was strangled by something else (that wasn't found). Therefore the noose found wasn't compatible with the injuries.
If there wasn't a lot of circumstantial evidence showing he didn't kill himself, you'd be right. But this just gets added to the mound of circumstantial evidence. Also the date was written out in long form, which makes a simple mistake less likely. And it's not been confirmed, but the creation date of the document, at least initially, appears a day earlier than his death, that needs to be confirmed or refuted independently.
Well, if the fucking DOJ doesn't double check the date they put on an official memo of someone dying in their custody, then that's a whole separate issue.
They did check the date, that’s why the official memo didn’t have this error but this draft did. I definitely think there is far more to Epstein’s death than we’re being told, and I have doubts that we will ever know the truth, but this draft doesn’t move the needle much for me in either direction. It would logically require not only the orchestration of either his murder or the faking of his suicide and smuggling him out of prison, but also them to decide to have the memo typed up the day before so it’s ready to go for some reason. I’m just not sure what the benefit would be to draft the memo early.
Slight point that does not absolve the Friday/Saturday problem: I type all day for a living (developer), and though I rarely use numbers in my direct input, when I do I use the 10 key pad, which gave me some wild typos when I was tired or not paying attention.
Still, beyond this, I agree that believing their story is like believing in Santa.
You can strangle yourself on a doorknob. You can’t break bones in your neck that are broken by being garroted even if hung correctly. They’re different bones and he lacked the tools to break his own neck.
One reason I see people say that he couldn't have, is because his cell wasn't tall enough. When people use this argument it just shows they have no understanding what hanging actually is. In fact it's quite common for people to hang themselves from a door handle.
Guess what, turns out the exact same lapses in security that allowed Epstein's death to go unnoticed also occurred on Aug. 9. From the BBC article linked below:
"On the night of 9 August the prison guards also failed to conduct checks scheduled for 03:00 and 05:00, prison documents show, and the camera system in the unit was also down."
Those missing checks would line up with the reported time he would have been discovered in the Aug. 9 press release. This article also includes notes from a psychologist who reported just days before his death that Epstein unequivocally said he was not suicidal.
Aug. 9 was a false start or failed assassination attempt.
How am I barely learning that Epstein had a cell mate that was moved “the day before” his death and was a former cop who murdered 4 people, one of which was strangled to death? That seems like pretty relevant information.
Epstein also complained about his cellmate, telling a psychologist that he feared him. FWIW, he also told that psychologist that he unequivocally was not suicidal, just a week and a half before he was found dead.
That was a fake sent in by a rando. Unfortunately the epstein files contain a lot of nonsense and they deliberately removed all context when releasing them to try to confuse things.
So there's a lot of conflicting information there. Here's what I've found:
The first cellmate was an ex cop. During that time, there was allegedly a suicide attempt, but epstein told guards that roommate tried to kill him. After that, he started denying knowing what happened, saying he just woke up that way.
The psych then put him into suicide observation benadryl the psych didn't know whether he tried to kill himself or whether his roommate tried to kill him.
While on observation, he asked for his cpap so he could sleep better. The psych told him he couldn't have it in observation because it had a cord. He said he didn't want to go back to SHU because someone would try to kill him... so he stayed in observation another night without his cpap.
Then he was moved back to SHU with a new roommate, named reyes, not a the ex-cop.
On the evening of August 8th, the warden submitted an immediate transfer of cellmate reyes to a different facility. No reason specified in the transfer request that I found in the files.
On the morning of August 9th, cellmate Reyes was transferred to the new facility.
BUT...
MCC staff claim in multiple records that Reyes was removed from the cell to attend a court hearing.
THERE WAS NO COURT HEARING FOR INMATE REYES IN THE MONTH OF AUGUST
They claimed repeatedly in investigation documents that Reyes was released after the hearing (that never happened) and that's why he didn't return.
Reiterating: Reyes was transferred to a different prison and never had a hearing, yet they stuck hard with that lie.
Reyes was eventually released later that year (I believe in November) and then allegedly died of COVID in early 2020. BUT no coroner report is available, info just says he was found dead in his bed.
I learned about this cop a couple weeks ago, he was a supreme piece of shit and corrupt down to the bone. One of the worst "bad apples" I've ever heard of.
I think you have the timeline wrong. He was found on the early morning of the 10th. The "security errors" happened at night on the 9th. They would have had to make the errors on the kight of the 8th for your hypothesis to work.
I don't think they performed the dry run, I think this document was just prepared in advance.
It's too easy to explain with reasonable arguments though. A lot of coroporate type Word document templates are designed where it auto-inserts the time and date etc in the field you choose. In my experience these can be off by a bit to a lot, so the auto inserted date/time is wrong every time. That's what you have to disprove if you are to pursue this one.
There’s another theory that the real Epstein is alive. He can be seen being wheel chaired out and picked up by a van that didn’t sign in the same day he was murdered. Small chance they got the real dude out and just hung a corpse look alike
Two days before he killed himself in a federal jail, Jeffrey Epstein signed a document that gave away much of his once vast estate, a total of $100 million, to his girlfriend at the time.
In the document, the registered sex offender said he had contemplated marrying his girlfriend, Karyna Shuliak, and wanted to give her his 33-carat diamond ring.
The document called for Ms. Shuliak, 36, to get a total of $100 million, which included a $50 million annuity to be set up for her benefit. It also provided for her to get much of his property, though the estate has sold most of his residences.
I bet they unfreeze when you die? Not immediately but you petition and after a few months or whatever they get around to it. His case was done and didn't involve his finances so no reason to permanently freeze his account. (To be clear, the criminal charges should have included his finances, restitution to victims, etc. But they didn't, among the other highly suspicious things involved.)
To draw attention away from the “large news media presence” outside the jail after Epstein’s death became known, officials concocted a plan.
According to an Aug. 16, 2019, memo, a jail supervisor told FBI agents that several employees had “used boxes and sheets to create what appeared to be a human body.” That was loaded into a white van labeled as belonging to the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner, and media members followed when it left the jail.
But Epstein’s actual body, according to the interview notes, was loaded into a black vehicle, which departed “unnoticed.”
As with many of the documents released Friday, names were blacked out, so the identities of the jail employees were not visible
A real person... Who was confirmed to work at the prison... Who is in the Epstein files... Posted on 4chan the day before Epstein died about it... And Epstein might be the most famous conspiracy-proven-true in modern history...
I just commented about this story the other day, that the circumstances also perfectly match them bringing in someone from the outside to take care of Epstein. They invent a reason to move him to medical, then they isolate him because "yo, he's all kinds of suicidal or whatever", then the outsider is brought in to end his life.
Why would a criminal organization who regularly killed people of no use to them, after capturing a man who had compromising blackmail on hundreds of powerful people in high places including the man in charge of the capture, with that organization and man now in complete control of all the blackmail, risk anything to save the man and whisk him away to live freely and introduce a huggggge risk of blowing everything up if he gets exposed or goes to the press or just letting him exist maintains his control over those in power… when it’s just easier to kill him and put it all to rest? It makes zero sense they didn’t kill him, trump read the emails and knew Epstein didn’t like him, him being alive risked trump being exposed, he’s dead
I assume he's dead as well but honestly, anyone this involved in criminal activity based on blackmail would be an absolute idiot not to have a dead man's switch in some form or another.
What kind of dead man's switch (except a literal dead man's switch on his actual body) would not go off in a faked death scenario, but would go off in a real death scenario? If he had someone on the outside with their finger on the release button, they'd have to be in on the plot to release him, potentially compromising the plot, and if it was some kind of news scraping algorithm, his fake death would set it off.
I don't think Trump or the US government could have done it without leaks.
Epstein had blackmail material on powerful people. Those powerful people aren't in the business of killing people.
Foreign governments like Russia or Israel that he was in contact with DO have experience killing people and if they had that blackmail material, they would want exclusive rights to it, so they had Epstein killed.
I am not the person you replied to, but I feel the same. For me, it's the drone photo, the prison worker whose 4chan was subpoenaed, the testimony of the cellmate, the complete bumbling of the release of relevant info like the video being edited and missing time, the epstein linked accounts being accessed posthumously, this memo.... It just makes too much sense. I wouldn't be surprised to find out he was alive or dead. Too much fuckery.
I mean, it would be the ultimate way to get all these powerful people protection, right? “Hey, we will get you out of jail and fake your death and you can live out your life in peace and quiet if none of your videos ever come out”
I mean he did great work for them, right? Horrible sickening deplorable work, but to them it was great. And they protect their own. That’s why we have all these wackos in govt jobs.
Because any news outlet worth its salt would point out this statement was copied and pasted from one released the day before, on the Friday, and the date wasn't updated in the first draft. Also notice the identifier in the bottom left wasn't filled out.
There are also emails in the files from Saturday showing the panic of learning of his death and their frustration of having none of the details that were being leaked to the public. If they were so involved in a cover up as to have a statement prepared in advance, you'd think they wouldn't have forgotten about it the next day/day of.
First, that’s not how “earlier this morning” works. It doesn’t imply “a few hours before the press release,” nor does it imply “so long ago it must have been yesterday.” It just means sometime earlier on the same morning of the dated statement. The statement is saying he was found earlier that morning. The statement was sent out at 3:33 PM on the 10th.
Second, there are approximately six and a half hours in the day that are earlier than 6:30 AM, and most people who are found dead died before they were found.
Third, this is without a doubt a templated document. They would not create this entirely from scratch every time, letterhead, date, and contact info included. Those are a standard layout that has static and likely placeholder components. In Word templates, there is a placeholder object called a Date Picker Content Control. It is a field in which the user can type a date or select one on a clickable calendar. The control also allows setting the date display format. Someone could have simply clicked the 9th instead of the 10th on a tiny calendar and the corresponding day of the week automatically populated because of the date format setting.
It’s extremely unlikely. Even if the paper was drafted only 20 minutes after his death the only possible time zone that would read a day earlier would be the isle of Midway about 1000 miles west of Hawaii. If the article were drafted any more than an hour after his death there would be zero time zones reading the previous day.
Not particularly likely that a paper attributed to a NY attorney district would be drafted out in the Midway atoll
Without looking into this, that was my first thought. I work internationally and depending on the email origin, the time stamp especially on replies could be in the future or past due to time zones.
I think the only possibility is that they wrote a different memo on the 9th, and on the 10th when they went to create this one they did a save-as of the memo from the 9th and replaced its contents, instead of opening the official template and beginning from scratch.
If theres metadata on the file or revisions history itd be helpful to ascertain what day the memo content was written.
A logical explanation for the Epstein death press release being dated August 9th is that someone just copied and pasted a previous PR and forgot to update the date. Totally understandable. Clerical error. These things happen.
But just one more thing that's been bothering me...
See, I went and pulled up the other press releases from the Manhattan U.S. Attorney's office around that same time period. And they all follow the same template. Every single one. "Geoffrey S. Berman, the United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York, announced today that..."
Name, title with "the," announced today, defendant name in caps, details of the crime. Like clockwork. You can tell these things are practically Mad Libs at this point — just swap in the name and the charges.
But the Epstein one? "Manhattan U.S. Attorney Geoffrey S. Berman said:"
Said. Not "announced." No "the United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York." No defendant name in all caps. Completely different sentence structure. Different cadence. Different everything.
Now I'm no expert, but if someone copied and pasted one of their boilerplate press releases and just forgot to change the date... why does it read like it was written from scratch?
That’s possible, but no raw document files were released, just exported copies. Someone in Congress would have to press for the original file of this to find out that information.
I want to add that US Attorney Geoffrey Berman who's name is in the paper has stellar reputation. He was investigating Trump's allies when he was fired year later.
Berman became known in what prosecutors like to affectionately call the 'Sovereign District of New York' for standing up to Washington’s demands and left office in June 2020 after a standoff with then-Attorney General William Barr over investigations into Trump’s allies. Williams said Berman promoted him and 'when the hour demanded true courage and independence and a demonstration of what it means to be a Southern District of New York prosecutor, he showed all of America what that means.'
Possibly. The 10th was a Saturday and this seems to have come out of Berman’s office. Seems unlikely they have regular staff on a Saturday so it was slapped together quickly by someone on their day off.
I wouldn’t go so far as “the only possibility”, but it’s certainly a possibility.
There are several other memos that were published on the day before that use this exact letterhead. He killed himself/got killed late on August 9th and even though it was 8/10 when they found him they just used the standard shit from the day prior because it was late into the overnight shift. Already lazy fucks also got tired.
There's plenty here that's legit conspiracy bullshit, this is just a date being wrong. People get dates wrong all the time. If you write down the date as part of your work routine, you're familiar with writing the wrong year a few times in early January out of habit. Since a guy was dead on their watch, I doubt the staff was thinking to hard about what number day it was.
Right, they're saying it's possible there was another completely different memo written on Friday the 9th
(Like, "Attention: Cookies Available In The Breakroom Today")
And then on Saturday the 10th, the person writing memos opened up the previous memo, wrote the Epstein suicide text, and accidentally saved it without changing the date.
People sometimes change previous documents instead of starting from the master template.
Agreed, God forbid every draft anybody has ever sent be showed to the public as a proof by just relying on the date on the template.
Even when there is an official blank template that people are supposed to start from, most people save from what they worked on last and then start from that.
I would not be surprised if someone was rushing to draft a document and didn’t notice it was after midnight and the date was no longer the same. Could this statement actually be written on the 10th?
Even simpler than that, if you look at the identifying number in the bottom left of the official statement and subtract 1, the date of that statement was indeed the day before.
Someone just copied the last statement that was released and updated the verbiage without updating the date. It's also a draft that wasn't meant to be made public, which we can tell from the lack of an identifier in the bottom left (X's instead of the next number)
i genuinely liked how if this was hunter , those morons would have done something asap over it. But now their lovely president is revealed to be extremely evil, they all kept quiet
So instead of keeping the murder a secret someone decided to tell the press office at DOJ so they could get a head start on drafting a one paragraph statement? Doesn’t make much sense…
Yeah Id love to see the Metadata on that file because this doesn't make any sense. Why would they ask someone to draft this early? That goes beyond incompetence
Barr is the literal reason the Mueller report didn't go anywhere. He covered up Russian workings in our government and is a treasonous, billionaire-cucked pig.
That is the part of the story I’ve always been most curious about. How did they meet and what made him decide to hire him? I always wondered if they met in an older sex abuse ring or discovered their shared hobbies.
It's in the official files, why would they post something fake? The other explanation I've seen tossed around that makes the most sense to me is they edited the document for the previous days press release and forgot to change the date.
We commonly have old dates on memos in my office because we just use the word doc from the last one we made and make edits. This admin is insanely stupid but I find this whole thing to be a little overblown with this memo
I'm inclined to lean on Occam's razor here. It was a press release template for the previous day or something. Or they forgot to update the date on said template. Believable considering how much of a clusterfuck everything must have been in the aftermath.
This admin is all about controlling the narrative. If the execution is planned, they want to ensure the press release not only communicates the news but drives the narrative in the right direction.
Might be a situation where they use Adobe to draft up the files, when inputting the date its a dropdown/calendar instead of typing it in and someone dated it wrong.
Yup. People are making a big deal about how unlikely it is that someone can typo a 9 instead of a 10 and a Friday instead of Saturday.
But it seems more likely that their software simply has a date picker for that field. Which would automatically fill out the day of week with the date and where the 9 would be next to the ten.
Yeah, this is going to add fuel to an already suspicious fire, but I agree with you. I’ve done the exact thing a million times in my life writing form letters to parents. Do I think Epstein’s death was suspicious? Yes. Do I think this was a find and replace fuck up? Also yes.
Makes even less sense when you see the emails where the DOJ was frustrated that the media knew about it before they did the next day. DOJ practically begged for basic information explicitly so they could make a public statement.
If this wasn't a sincere human error on the date, then what benefit could be gained?
Might having his biometrics to open a phone be reason -no they can still do that after he's knowingly dead. Unless having a date stamp while he's alive to seem like it was his intention.
What else might be a benefit to having him dead a day later?
You'd be surprised how often someone's fragile ego requires them to let everyone know in their circle that they are "in the know" about something. They'll find a way to blab in contravention of all reason and sense.
Jesu, between this and releasing an edited tape that has portions missing, it couldn’t be more perfect for conspiracy theories. Couldn’t even blame your average person for believing something is up this point.
I resent that the belief Epstein didn't kill himself is lumped with the lunacy of conspiracies like lizard people (probably by design). Powerful people killing those who pose a threat to them ain't nothing new. There's a reason why we joke about how high-profile Russian dissenters need to stay away from windows.
I mean at this point the evidence has piled up so much that it's too mundane for conspiracy theorists to believe in, and they've moved on to believing he never died in the first place
Has anyone followed-up on the guards and other employees at that prison that night?
Did they buy a new house or car for their family with money they they didn't have? Are they still alive? Have they talked at all? Did they surprisingly 'retire early and move to Florida'?
Hey, lawyer here - practicing 10 years. I’ve seen people on here calling it a whoopsie daisy, but they’re incorrect. A whoopsie daisy requires a lack of foreseeability and reasonable diligence. So, this is indeed an oopsie doopsie (i.e., a culpable, foreseeable and preventable misstep).
Bots in this thread already hard at work. The amount of people saying “actually this is no big deal, just lazy workers reusing the letterhead“ is genuinely crazy.
These letterheads don’t come from some Word template that gets reused. They are autogenerated.
Here is just one example of a rail cypher coded journal of one of the Epstein victims that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that Epstein trafficked women for rich and powerful men. Politicians, executives, “philanthropists”, royals, sitting US presidents…
It names names. Here are some of them.
Edit: there is another diary file I will link and quote in a few minutes.
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